Southern York County Life

As far as the math program which is called everyday math, I had my concerns at first....my daughter had it starting in first grade and I thought that she would never get it and would be very far behind, I called and spoke with her teachers many times and they reassured me that it would work and I had to give it time.  She is now in the fifth grade and on her last report card she had a 96.5 grade.  She has learned all of the math facts that I did as a child but in a different way.  We have to give the new ways a try and help our children at home if they are struggling.  I have changed my mind about everyday math and am glad that all of my other children have started since kindergarten in it.

My experience with Everyday Math has been excellent.  I like that the kids are exposed to concepts very early without realizing what they are.  The only issue I have is that it wasnt adopted across the board.  My kids have gone from Everyday Math to back to a more traditional program, and have not done as well.  I know that we have extensively worked with multiplication tables, and if you dont think your child is being taught that enough then you need to see the teacher.  It is important that they be able to ‘know’ those, not just have a little song or something to help them remember them.

Margie, you are entitled to your opinion, but I also know that I am not alone in feeling that the children and teachers were verbally attacked. Those students left feeling like they let everyone down because the people didn’t say anything good about their math program. And yes, I know this for a fact.

Teresa16401 - 21 March 2008 04:58 PM

As far as the math program which is called everyday math, I had my concerns at first....my daughter had it starting in first grade and I thought that she would never get it and would be very far behind, I called and spoke with her teachers many times and they reassured me that it would work and I had to give it time.  She is now in the fifth grade and on her last report card she had a 96.5 grade.  She has learned all of the math facts that I did as a child but in a different way.  We have to give the new ways a try and help our children at home if they are struggling.  I have changed my mind about everyday math and am glad that all of my other children have started since kindergarten in it.

I felt the same thing.  My child’s average is now 96.  We spent many nights at the kitchen table when everyday math begain...we still do 5 years later.  It is a good thing because parents should be involved w/the education of their kids.  I know I learned a few things when it comes to math. It was a little scary 5 years ago because most paents did not know how to do it. But now I am pleased w/the everyday program.

livelaughlove - 21 March 2008 05:20 PM

Margie, you are entitled to your opinion, but I also know that I am not alone in feeling that the children and teachers were verbally attacked. Those students left feeling like they let everyone down because the people didn’t say anything good about their math program. And yes, I know this for a fact.

No, you are not alone.  This stuff has be happening since December.  Since it is open public comment, people do have that right… some just do not think before they speak and how their words can negatively impact children in the room.

Marge - 21 March 2008 12:50 PM

The main reasons we worked so hard on the presentation are:

We elect School Board members to be active in the running of the school system.  They are not experts in every field that comes up in the process and we don‘t expect them to be.  However, we feel there are many in the community who do have the expertise in the various fields and can provide invaluable assistance to help the Board run the system efficiently and expertly.

We expect the Board’s Committee chairpersons/members to actually do work, not just report what others did and said at their meetings.  They need to conduct research, solicit advice, whatever is needed to get the job done properly. (A bill for $9,561 is included in our presentation from Sponaugle for the wood shop exhaust system.  According to Green Heck, the Green Heck Model 100LM exhaust assembly does not exist - there is no such model.)

We know the Board has an enormous responsibility and its job is not an easy one.  If our recommendations are implemented by the Board, it will make their job easier and possibly save money along the way.

Just curious...was Sponaugle called and asked about the Green Heck Model 100LM that was on their invoice? and did you present this info at theB&G;meeting first? I never went to one of those meetings.  If you did, how was it percieved. Has the tax coalition had a chance to talk to the new board members about all the B and G problems?  I really do not know where they stand on all of this.  I think you done some good research by the way

livelaughlove - 21 March 2008 05:20 PM

Margie, you are entitled to your opinion, but I also know that I am not alone in feeling that the children and teachers were verbally attacked. Those students left feeling like they let everyone down because the people didn’t say anything good about their math program. And yes, I know this for a fact.

I really don’t have an opinion on Everyday Math.  And, it was an observation, rather than my opinion, that the children and teachers were not attacked.  I personally think the students did an excellent job in their presentation and problem solving.  A few positive comments were made by the audience.  It’s just the parents with concerns spoke longer.  If you have experience with the program, you should have spoken up at the meeting and praised its merits.  You may have quelled some of the other parents’ concerns.

ProudParent - 21 March 2008 06:28 PM

Marge - 21 March 2008 12:50 PM

The main reasons we worked so hard on the presentation are:

We elect School Board members to be active in the running of the school system.  They are not experts in every field that comes up in the process and we don‘t expect them to be.  However, we feel there are many in the community who do have the expertise in the various fields and can provide invaluable assistance to help the Board run the system efficiently and expertly.

We expect the Board’s Committee chairpersons/members to actually do work, not just report what others did and said at their meetings.  They need to conduct research, solicit advice, whatever is needed to get the job done properly. (A bill for $9,561 is included in our presentation from Sponaugle for the wood shop exhaust system.  According to Green Heck, the Green Heck Model 100LM exhaust assembly does not exist - there is no such model.)

We know the Board has an enormous responsibility and its job is not an easy one.  If our recommendations are implemented by the Board, it will make their job easier and possibly save money along the way.

Just curious...was Sponaugle called and asked about the Green Heck Model 100LM that was on their invoice? and did you present this info at theB&G;meeting first? I never went to one of those meetings.  If you did, how was it percieved. Has the tax coalition had a chance to talk to the new board members about all the B and G problems?  I really do not know where they stand on all of this.  I think you done some good research by the way

Thank you, ProudParent!  The discrepancy was discovered after the last B&G;meeting.  We included it in the presentation as an example of why an Advisory Committee is needed. That is just one example; there are others.  We didn’t call Sponaugle - that is really up to the B&G;Committee Chairperson to do.  The entire Board is aware of the B&G;problems.  The problems are being addressed.  Our concerns now, which are documented in the presentation, are that the proper solutions to the problems be applied, that the work be done right the first time, that warranties be obtained, and that the District is not overcharged for the work.  We have talked with some of the new Board members and they want the problems fixed and done so at a reasonable cost. 

If you are interested in the school matters, I would suggest attending the Committee meetings.  This is where the decisions are made.  By the time an issue is brought to the full Board, the decision, for the most part, has already been made.  This applies to all the Committees - not just B&G;.  You can check the dates and locations of the Committee meetings on our website: http://www.setrc.net

P.S. The next meeting we attend where Sponaugle is present, we will ask about the Model #.

Thank you Marge for your input. 

As a taxpayer, I appreciate your efforts.  I am surprised about who your new president is though...some have witnessed his behavior in past SB meetings before he was made your president and it turned a lot of people off.  You have always been respectful though. Do you think that is going to hurt your group when it comes to working w/Dr. Shank and other board members.  Because he already stated she was a liar and that gets people nowhere when they want to work w/her and the board. No disrespect towards you… just wondering.

ProudParent - 21 March 2008 08:58 PM

Thank you Marge for your input. 

As a taxpayer, I appreciate your efforts.  I am surprised about who your new president is though...some have witnessed his behavior in past SB meetings before he was made your president and it turned a lot of people off.  You have always been respectful though. Do you think that is going to hurt your group when it comes to working w/Dr. Shank and other board members.  Because he already stated she was a liar and that gets people nowhere when they want to work w/her and the board. No disrespect towards you… just wondering.

Our president was probably a little over-zealous then, but is more composed now.  As you may have seen, he removed his posts from this forum on his own accord.  John’s enthusiasm and knowledge has been an asset to the Coalition.  We have worked with Dr. Shank since he became president, and Dr. Shank has been very accommodating and forthcoming.  I believe the Board knows we are trying to help, not hinder, and if there are any obstacles, we will work to overcome them.

Marge - 21 March 2008 10:21 PM

ProudParent - 21 March 2008 08:58 PM

Thank you Marge for your input. 

As a taxpayer, I appreciate your efforts.  I am surprised about who your new president is though...some have witnessed his behavior in past SB meetings before he was made your president and it turned a lot of people off.  You have always been respectful though. Do you think that is going to hurt your group when it comes to working w/Dr. Shank and other board members.  Because he already stated she was a liar and that gets people nowhere when they want to work w/her and the board. No disrespect towards you… just wondering.

Our president was probably a little over-zealous then, but is more composed now.  As you may have seen, he removed his posts from this forum on his own accord.  John’s enthusiasm and knowledge has been an asset to the Coalition.  We have worked with Dr. Shank since he became president, and Dr. Shank has been very accommodating and forthcoming.  I believe the Board knows we are trying to help, not hinder, and if there are any obstacles, we will work to overcome them.

That is really great to know! When I first sign on to SYC and saw all the “!” so I did not see what he wrote..I wondered what that as for.  Thank you for answering my questions. 

Marge - 21 March 2008 10:21 PM

Our president was probably a little over-zealous then, but is more composed now.  As you may have seen, he removed his posts from this forum on his own accord.  John’s enthusiasm and knowledge has been an asset to the Coalition.  We have worked with Dr. Shank since he became president, and Dr. Shank has been very accommodating and forthcoming.  I believe the Board knows we are trying to help, not hinder, and if there are any obstacles, we will work to overcome them.

I thought the presentation was good. That being said, the only thing is I thought it was unfortunate that the words “Gross Incompetence” was used toward the end. I think if you are trying to send a message of mutual work toward a common goal, maybe not labeling the administration and school board as incompetent would go a long way toward achieving that goal. Just my opinion.
Otherwise a good job, and your efforts ARE appreciated.

Barnyard - 22 March 2008 11:11 AM

Marge - 21 March 2008 10:21 PM

Our president was probably a little over-zealous then, but is more composed now.  As you may have seen, he removed his posts from this forum on his own accord.  John’s enthusiasm and knowledge has been an asset to the Coalition.  We have worked with Dr. Shank since he became president, and Dr. Shank has been very accommodating and forthcoming.  I believe the Board knows we are trying to help, not hinder, and if there are any obstacles, we will work to overcome them.

I thought the presentation was good. That being said, the only thing is I thought it was unfortunate that the words “Gross Incompetence” was used toward the end. I think if you are trying to send a message of mutual work toward a common goal, maybe not labeling the administration and school board as incompetent would go a long way toward achieving that goal. Just my opinion.
Otherwise a good job, and your efforts ARE appreciated.

Barnyard,
If you think renovating the buildings, not maintaining them, making people sick, repairing renovations with millions of dollars and being billed for things not even in existence is not gross incompetence (just to name a few!), what is? Don’t forget the members on the board who are on the buildings and grounds committee were made aware of these issues YEARS ago and are even being sued for the problems, yet they still sit on that particular committee!  I have watched the presentation online and I think the purpose of it was to show the incompetence and to offer alternate solutions.  Many of the solutions should have been enacted because as the presentation stated, they are already board policies.  Again, sounds like incompetence to me.  Just my opinion.

Thank you, Wasted...you basically provided my answer.  I will add the phrase “gross incompetence” was a deliberate choice of words.  And I don’t think anyone on the Board or Dr. Shank will dispute it.  By the way, this work was done under Tom McShane’s watch, not Dr. Shank’s.  She inherited this problem and is doing the best she can to get it corrected.  If our recommendations are followed, Dr. Shank can get back to her specialty, which is education, and get out of the construction business.

I was just informed by a SESD employee good friend of mine today that the district has posted all the emergency cert professionals by name on their website!!  What kind of leader would allow this?  Even better the classes they have taken towards certification and the money the district has reimbursed each individual is also posted by name on the website.  If this is not a crystal clear indication of the type of working conditions these SESD professionals are working in I don’t know what is?  Why was that necessary?  Even if someone asked Dragon for the names that does not mean you hang your people out to dry!  I have never seen a more incompetent leadership style than what has been continually exhibited in SESD.  What if someone asks for bra sizes?  Will they be posted on the website?  You can address inordinate numbers without names.  How about some dignity for these employees?  One of the names of emergency cert administrators has not even started working at SESD yet - what a nice ‘welcome to the district’.  Maybe an explanation as to why the permanent and long term sub emerg cert numbers have doubled from last year rather than intimidating these people in their positions with posting their names.  Will they double again next year Dragon?