markG - 29 June 2008 05:25 PM

pooch - 29 June 2008 04:35 PM

I hope that utmost respect converts to some tangible support for us teachers as this new contract desperately needs to be agreed upon.  The teachers of SESD are not being compensated at an amount that is consistent with the rest of York County.  I know that the tax coalition will try to have my head on this point, but I will still make it anyway!  At a time when SESD is looking to hold onto their teachers, to regain that once stable environment we all enjoyed...I think that everyone involved must realize that it is very simple for most teachers to leave SESD and acquire a position within another York Co. school district that includes at least a 10K raise +.  Coupled with the price of gas, with many making long commutes to this lower end of the county....this will NOT be a contract that needs to skimp on a fair (mind you...not an earthshattering increase) but just a fair contract that will put teachers in SESD on par with other area school district’s salary tables.

I respect teachers.  My best friend is a teacher of 14 years.  I also believe that the new contract is not a one-way street.  There needs to be a happy medium in the negotiation process.  I would venture to say that most of the employers of citizens in the district have raised health care costs while not increasing salaries to match.  These are tough economic times and most employees expect not to see hugh increases, but that can not be said by most teacher’s unions.  How many teachers have gone on strike or threatened to strike over the past 2 years? 

I did some research on average salaries in York County and our crack State Department of Education only has statistics through the 2005-2006 year.  According to these stats only 2 districts in York County are have a >$10k salary difference, Dallastown and York Suburban.  I have no problem with a reasonable increase in salary if you would like to concede some health benefit costs, but if the union is looking for $10k then I will help make your picket signs.

I’m with you, Mark G!  Point well made, thank you.

Wasted - 02 July 2008 09:17 AM

pooch - 29 June 2008 04:35 PM

I hope that utmost respect converts to some tangible support for us teachers as this new contract desperately needs to be agreed upon.  The teachers of SESD are not being compensated at an amount that is consistent with the rest of York County.  I know that the tax coalition will try to have my head on this point, but I will still make it anyway!  At a time when SESD is looking to hold onto their teachers, to regain that once stable environment we all enjoyed...I think that everyone involved must realize that it is very simple for most teachers to leave SESD and acquire a position within another York Co. school district that includes at least a 10K raise +.  Coupled with the price of gas, with many making long commutes to this lower end of the county....this will NOT be a contract that needs to skimp on a fair (mind you...not an earthshattering increase) but just a fair contract that will put teachers in SESD on par with other area school district’s salary tables.

Pooch, I am in no way associated with the tax coalition, but I too would like to have your head on this point!  Simply put, you don’t like the money you are making?  GO!

Pooch is no longer an employee or lives in the district.

When looking at compensation, you must look at the combined salary plus fringe benefits (most of which are the health
premiums).  In order to save money my company have switched to a high deductible plan.  The premiums are much smaller, but I have to pay more out of pocket each time I get a perscription filled or see a doctor.  The purpose of the plan is to help the individual realize the cost of health care.  The total of the premium plus my family deductible is less than the premium is for a non-high deductible plan.

i.e.
Std.  High Deductible

Premium (Family PPO) 13,000 8,000
Deductible 2,000 4,000

Maximum Cost 15,000 12,000

If I only utilize 1,000 worth of my deductible, then the costs would be:

Std.  High Deductible

Premium (Family PPO) 13,000 8,000
Deductible 1,000 1,000

Actual Cost 14,000 9,000

I would save 5,000 in health care costs per year.  Even if I utilized my entire deductible, it still would save 3,000 per year

The questions really are:  1) How much per teacher/employee is the district paying, 2) What percentage of the premium is being paid, and 3) is a high deductible plan being used.

ProudParent - 02 July 2008 09:43 AM

Wasted - 02 July 2008 09:17 AM

pooch - 29 June 2008 04:35 PM

I hope that utmost respect converts to some tangible support for us teachers as this new contract desperately needs to be agreed upon.  The teachers of SESD are not being compensated at an amount that is consistent with the rest of York County.  I know that the tax coalition will try to have my head on this point, but I will still make it anyway!  At a time when SESD is looking to hold onto their teachers, to regain that once stable environment we all enjoyed...I think that everyone involved must realize that it is very simple for most teachers to leave SESD and acquire a position within another York Co. school district that includes at least a 10K raise +.  Coupled with the price of gas, with many making long commutes to this lower end of the county....this will NOT be a contract that needs to skimp on a fair (mind you...not an earthshattering increase) but just a fair contract that will put teachers in SESD on par with other area school district’s salary tables.

Pooch, I am in no way associated with the tax coalition, but I too would like to have your head on this point!  Simply put, you don’t like the money you are making?  GO!

Pooch is no longer an employee or lives in the district.

Too bad :( Guess the $$$$$ was better somewhere else and the taxes got too high to pay for teachers’ salaries here, huh?!

An interesting note on the salary issue.  How many teachers are there in the district?  What would a cash bonus to each teacher each year of the contract cost?  Probably not terribly much in the scope of the entire contract or the budget as a whole.  There is a point where you can be too stingy with your money, and it is a fact that you get what you pay for.

JustPlainC - 02 July 2008 02:52 PM

An interesting note on the salary issue.  How many teachers are there in the district?  What would a cash bonus to each teacher each year of the contract cost?  Probably not terribly much in the scope of the entire contract or the budget as a whole.  There is a point where you can be too stingy with your money, and it is a fact that you get what you pay for.

There also comes a point when you have to learn to say “NO.” By the way, it is not always a fact that you get what you pay for.  I know a lot of cases where you don’t get what you pay for!

I can pretty much guarantee you got what you paid for.  You just didnt pay the right person.

I understand the point of saying no.  But from the perspective of the School District as a business entity negotiating with the teachers union, it is important to find a balance in that.  The best contract is likely to leave everyone with unmet demands.  I could certainly use a pay raise, as the cost of gas and everything else has gone up for me just as it is for them.  But as an individual, I have little leverage in what I can demand for salary.  The teachers union is in a position to be negotiating for a new contract at a time when inflation is eating up a lot of what people bring home.  And they are going to use the opportunity to thier best advantage.  I would.

So what does make a fair contract?

JustPlainC - 02 July 2008 04:04 PM

I can pretty much guarantee you got what you paid for.  You just didnt pay the right person.

I understand the point of saying no.  But from the perspective of the School District as a business entity negotiating with the teachers union, it is important to find a balance in that.  The best contract is likely to leave everyone with unmet demands.  I could certainly use a pay raise, as the cost of gas and everything else has gone up for me just as it is for them.  But as an individual, I have little leverage in what I can demand for salary.  The teachers union is in a position to be negotiating for a new contract at a time when inflation is eating up a lot of what people bring home.  And they are going to use the opportunity to thier best advantage.  I would.

So what does make a fair contract?

C,

There has to be a happy middle ground somewhere, and that is what the teacher’s union historically has worked against.  There have been quite a few districts in the Central PA area that have threatened a strike or they have had a strike in the last few years.  This union will strike if they do not get exactly what they ask for, and hopefully we have a professional negotiation team representing the district.  If not, it will be all give.

Also, from the point of view of getting what you pay for I feel that is flawed logic in this case.  Your assumption is the same as Students First in that a tenured teacher is representative of best available teacher.  Granted seasoned teachers can be better teachers, but there still needs to be a way other than tenure to evaluate a teacher’s ability.