I thought it would be best to create a new topic for this subject rather than posting comments under the School Tax/Property Tax topic.

I’ve read all the statements made pertaining to the captioned.

First of all I think everyone needs to calm down a little and listen to the facts before going off in a state of rage.

There are no absolute plans that have been made for a stadium at all.

The school board has not taken any action on the stadium.
Nothing can be done without the school board’s approval.
The school board has the final say not the booster club.

The school board did create a sports committee and Ann Wilson serves on that committee.

Ann Wilson is a liason between the school district and the booster club.
Ann Wilson reported to the school board that the booster club has a stadium committee.

The proposed stadium is not going to be a state of the art stadium as many people think.
The proposed stadium will not be a massive stadium as seems to be the thoughts in most people’s minds.
At the present moment there are no lights at any of the designated sports area.
The new track is being looked at for the proposed stadium.
The proposed stadium would have bleachers and lights and an announcers stand.
It is possible another site for the proposed stadium could be where football is right now.

The proposed stadium as mentioned in another post is to be paid for by the booster club.
The cost to maintain the proposed stadium would be paid for by money received from sports events and fund raisers.

MEETING: - This Monday 7PM at the school library, the sports committee is scheduled to meet. The meeting was originally being called to talk about the proposed stadium. The proposed stadium will be a tiny part of Monday’s meeting.

In my opinion, I have no problem with a stadium as long as taxpayers will not be subjected to a tax increase because of it, whether to create it or to maintain it.

I read a post that mentioned school board Ann Wilson wants the stadium to increase school spirit. In my opinion, if she did say this, it is a poor excuse to create a stadium. A school’s spirit is what is within the students, teachers, administrators, etc. In other words the school is what those involved with it make it.

If anyone has any questions, comments or concerns pertaining to the proposed stadium, they need to be present at Monday’s meeting.

I have a lot of concerns with the post.

First of all it says that “there are no absolute plans that have been made for a stadium at all.” Then it goes on to state that, “the proposed stadium is not going to be a state of the art stadium as many people think.” What does this mean?  Plans and proposals mean the same to many people.  Then it states that, “at the present moment there are no lights at any of the designated sports area.” Hmm.  But, “the proposed stadium would have bleachers and lights and an announcers stand.” What does this mean?

Bottom line is that the poster has “no problem with a stadium as long as taxpayers will not be subjected to a tax increase because of it, whether to create ir or to maintain it.” We just were already stuck with a huge tax increase.  Or don’t you remember?  I suppose the SESD now has enough in the coffers to build a stadium.  I don’t give a flying rat’s - - - whether taxes will be increased or not.  They should have never been granted the huge tax increase last year that apparently can now be frittered away on stadiums.

Nothwithstanding the attempt in the previous post to have residents and taxpayers “calm down,” I am sick of this school district and their fast and loose spending.

Not to sound rude, but if you have such an issue with it, why are you here?
Unfortunately we live in a district with very little industrial and retail revenue. That would be a major help. Our district does not spend loosely. It spends what is necessary for our students. We have the highest teacher to student ratio in the county. We use books that are out of date. They do what they can for the students.
The federal and state governments have dropped the ball on funding which is why taxes needed to be raised. Feel free to do your research on this topic. I have attended school board meetings and it is very evident that many of those who speak out against the board and district are unprepared. Those who are prepared and have researched appropriately will see the real issue.

Many of us came here before the tax hike.  Secondly, many of us believe that more money does not equal a better education.  If the federal and state gov’t have dropped the ball on funding, go after them for the money, not the taxpayer.

I agree… going after those that dropped the ball is the best thing. But what do you do in the meantime while you are going after them? How many years could the case take? That even assumes you have a case which in this case, I don’t think they would from what I have read.

There are many problems with the way schools are funded. The property tax system is broken. There are options out there, but they (our elected State officials) won’t touch them. They are resisting any sales tax changes on the grounds that it will drive away travelers and tourists. Last I checked, people still flock to NYC despite paying 8% on everything.

There are other issues like the way they can plan for growth, funding formulas that favor Philadelphia/Pittsburgh schools, and of course, living with mistakes made in the past (like limited growth options). Many of the budget items are contractual and they can’t change them. This includes contracted salaries and benefits, special education fees, fuel, electricity, building debt… that does not leave much to play with. If I recall correctly, only about 6% of the budget goes towards sports/music/theater/etc.

We need to keep the whole mess in perspective. Do we need a stadium? I don’t think so, but if some outside organization is going to fund it as a gift and cover the upkeep, then fine. But if the tax payer foots any of the bill, I say no way.

Wolfgang - 17 January 2006 03:16 PM

I have a lot of concerns with the post.

First of all it says that “there are no absolute plans that have been made for a stadium at all.” Then it goes on to state that, “the proposed stadium is not going to be a state of the art stadium as many people think.” What does this mean?  Plans and proposals mean the same to many people.  Then it states that, “at the present moment there are no lights at any of the designated sports area.” Hmm.  But, “the proposed stadium would have bleachers and lights and an announcers stand.” What does this mean?

That is fact! There are no absolute plans that have been made for a stadium! All you hear is nothing but talk! There is nothing in writing!

What I meant by the proposed stadium is not going to be a state of the art stadium as many people think is, if you read the posts some posters made it sound like SESD was going to build Camden Yards! There will be no Camden Yards in SESD! I disagree that plans and proposals mean the same to many people. I think the wrong word is being used to describe this suggestion for a stadium. SESD has nothing to do with this shall we say “suggestion for a stadium.” The Booster Club is the organization that brought up the suggestion of a stadium and created their own stadium committee. The Booster Club has no control over SESD school board members. It is the Booster Club that would have to obtain permission from SESD school board members to do anything on school grounds not vice versus.

True where sports are played now there are no lights for night games. It is my understanding that what is being suggested is a bare bones area to play sports that would have bleachers. The Stewartstown Community Fairgrounds has bleachers. There is no talk about seats being plush and comfortable. Have you ever been to a community sports area where people play baseball, football? Take notice they are bare bone sports areas.

Bottom line is that the poster has “no problem with a stadium as long as taxpayers will not be subjected to a tax increase because of it, whether to create ir or to maintain it.” We just were already stuck with a huge tax increase.  Or don’t you remember?  I suppose the SESD now has enough in the coffers to build a stadium.  I don’t give a flying rat’s - - - whether taxes will be increased or not.  They should have never been granted the huge tax increase last year that apparently can now be frittered away on stadiums.

I don’t think any property owner in SESD has a problem with the suggested stadium as long as they don’t have to pay for it. Just like the homeowners in York City. Let those who want it build it! Keep their hands out of taxpayers pockets! If it isn’t going to cost you a single cent what is your gripe?

I’m fully aware of the recent huge tax increase SESD homeowners were recently hit with. Remember....I live here too and I have to pay the increase too! I was not happy with the hefty increase no more than I was happy with the hefty 27% increase levied upon homeowners when previous Superintendent Natter was here. That’s twice I was hit with hefty taxes in a 10 year period!

You say that “SESD now has enough in the coffers to build a stadium.” Again, the funding for the suggested stadium is not going to come from taxpayers dollars. It is coming from the Booster Club which is made up of local businesses. Not one cent of that hefty tax increase will be used if ever a “stadium” is built. The hefty tax increase was levied because previous members of the school board did not increase taxes when they should have. Now, don’t take that as I’m supportive of tax increases, because I’m not. I’m just trying to explain to you what was told to me when I questioned a couple of members of the school board. You say “you don’t give a flying rat’s --- whether taxes will be increased or not.” Well I do and so do thousands of others in SESD. Again, I repeat what part of not one cent of that recent tax increase will be used to create a stadium or sports area did you not understand?

I would like to think that the board is wise in that they would get this in writing from the Boosters Club.

Nothwithstanding the attempt in the previous post to have residents and taxpayers “calm down,” I am sick of this school district and their fast and loose spending.

Let me ask you a few questions-- How long have you lived here? During that time how many school board meetings have you attended? Do you know the names of your school board member representatives? Have you ever taken the time to speak with them personally about your concerns? Do you know the name of your State Senator and State Representative? Have you ever taken the time to speak with them personally about your concerns?

The place to be venting your anger isn’t at me or on this forum. Vent it where it belongs. Vent it to the school board. Most especially take the time to vent it to your State Senator and State Representative as that is where the real blame belongs. Our state legislators aren’t doing their job in representing their constituents best interests by getting more taxpayer dollars for SESD. They aren’t seeing to it that what homeowners pay is being returned to SESD. Instead they are letting our taxpayer dollars be given to Pittsburgh and Philadelphia school districts. SESD receives approximately 40% of what they should be receiving.

I think the school district releases this stuff just to give people something to gripe about.

Anyone been to the new Central High School, or Dallastown, etc.  You new move ins weren’t here when the pig farmer crap went on were you.  the times when visiting teams would oink across the sidelines at us.  I’m sick and tired of hearing people complain about this district.  they spent 25 million on the high school and it’s full already, same stuff went on then, people complained what do we need that for, oh that’s too much money.  it’s all bulls***.  So the cut stuff now we’re in a pickle lets gripe some more because you did what we said and you should have known better.  I’m tired of it this year coming up our taxes are supposed to 17.something mills what are all the other school districts?  Are we the highest, i guess the tax reform coalition can tell me all those facts. 

And to those who say school pride isn’t based on athletics you are obviously mistaken.  this area had no school pride until the early 90’s when Adam Miller lead our basketball team to states.  You didn’t see a single sole other than students wearing KD apparel but back then everyone had a cap, sweatshirt, tshirt or team basketball cards.  You move ins that thought you were coming here for a tax break, you did for awhile but the ruduced lunch is over, you gave all of us a tax burden.  It costs our district $9,000 to education one student per academic year.  How many years of school taxes does it take to pay that off.  If your child attends school from 1st-12th that would be a total of 108,000 and 4,500 for kindergarten because it is half day right now.  That’s a total of $112,500 dollars how long does it take you to pay for you kids education if you pay 2,000 in school tax per year??  you guessed it 56 years and 3 months. 

maybe the option is going back to the underacheiving maryland schools, our district performed in the top of the county in all of the NCLB categories.  Nobody likes hearing “sell and move” but you have and option. 

This is a great academic institution, it sucks that things are as expensive as they are but this is the world we live in.  most of us live very comfortable using plastic for the unforeseen problems, but a school district doesn’t have that option.  the must have the resources to pay for new hot water heaters, plumbers, and so forth.

Another thing, what’s up with the tax reform group meeting on tuesdays at 9 am, all they all retired folk because my guess is most of us working folk are on the job at 9 am.

I look for to being crucified by the posters here but i have spoken from my heart and what i feel.  except for the district stadium issue just to tick people off.  a stadium with light would be nice how many other schools have??  Football team looked better this year maybe friday night gate revenues could pay for all the athletic programs like basketball did in the 90’s.

Anyone see how the KD Brain Busters team did sunday??  Last year they were good, kinda made a name for themselves.

Wow, I guess us ‘move-ins’ have no right to voice an opinion.  I don’t think dividing the community into long-time residents and move-ins is the right thing to start.  I do not use your school system, I wouldn’t use the public school system where I was from either.  That is the choice I have made, but it sounds to me like this ‘move in’ is paying for your children’s education, not the other way around.  I didn’t come here to get a tax break, I did not come here for the schools, I came here to give my children a safer childhood, in a close knit community.  I thought it was a good decision, but from your post it sounds to me like maybe were not welcome.

The big issue for me is the dramatic increase in taxes, it hurt and imo, it should have been staggered.  Because it hurt, financially, I will disgress and say that maybe it has made me quick to criticize, however, from the moment I moved here (and it has been almost 4 years now) all I have heard is criticism for the district.  Maybe I’m sheltered because a lot of the people I know have pulled their kids and use alternatives to public school.  But on the other hand my children have friends in the same grade level in public school here and in MD and there big gap in the toughness of the curriculum, meaning it is more challenging.  It is tough to listen to the fact the the public school needs more money when my school has no funds from anywhere but from the parents and alumni.  When our heaters, water, or anything breaks it is the parents who volunteer their time and money to do the repairs.  Again, my choice, but we have out of date textbooks, we have 1 sports team, we have very modest buildings, and we’ve been through some very challenging times this year, but our school spirit is high.  I have never missed a meeting with our Principal or the Board, if I used the public school I wouldn’t miss a school board meeting either.  So if you look at it from this ‘move-ins’ view, I think there are alternatives, I asked previously what cuts were made before the hike, maybe there were, but I didn’t get an answer.  I’m sorry that you are offended by some comments and you think that we complain without reason or offering alternatives, but I can’t get involved in making changes because that would be hypocritical by the fact that I do not have my children attend.  All I think any of us want to see is an accountability to the taxpayer and the children of the district.  If the district is so great, it would be nice hear of the achievements, do some positive PR, for those in the community who pay for it and don’t have direct access to that information.  If I heard positive things, maybe it won’t hurt so much the next time the taxes are increased.

i’m not a member of the welcome wagon here.

sure you have a voice but every thread is complaining about the same thing it doesn’t fix it and it gets monatanous to re-read the same gripes all the time.  in case we didn’t realize it the state representative are not working on tax reform because south eastern has the only tax problem, the whole state is screwed up.  bevyjean, what is the tuition cost of your school?  why are you paying for an out dated education, don’t you expect more for your children?  start attending those board meetings, its close to budget time. 

are you aware that we the people brought this tax crunch on ourselves in a way.  the district offered an option to use capital monies to minimize tax increases over the last few years and the money is gone.  now the citizens that pushed for this are crying foul, we got what we asked for now the future is here and we must deal with the repercussions of that decision to save the taxpayers money then now. 

when i graduated i never had a typing or computer class because they were always over booked and i was a shopboy.  that really created a problem when the first college paper was due, i had no idea how to type, save my work, or even print it.  today we don’t have that problem, there are plenty of computers and they are expensive.  colleges have high expectations today, the more schools prepare students the more professors will expect in turn.  many people are expressing an opinion of our district that may have been true or partly true 15-20 years ago but maybe not now.

i don’t hate the fact people moved in here, but honestly there were variable that caused you to move here for other areas like the baltimore region.  the cost of housing in the baltimore area and the reasonable cost of homes here.  now the price is rising because of the hot market.  the safer neighberhood will be short lived with the influex of more and more people from urban areas.  thats why we need 5 cops in the Big City.  taxes were also less because homes were assessed at 70-75% of their fair market value now it is based closer to 100% of fmv.  I continually here people complain about the new assessments if the assessments are too high put your house on the market and sell for the assessment price, i’ll bet it sells in less than 2 weeks.  there are always consiquences for actions when alot of people move into an area the prices and taxes for services go up, it rarely goes down.

I like the fact that people also love the area i call home, because this part of the county is nice.  its far enough was from the cities and also close enough to them.

I didn’t mean outdated as far as the information, I meant not new.  I don’t think that many subjects need to be updated that often.  As a matter of fact, I do expect more for my children and FROM my children, which is why I made this choice and why I make the sacrifices.  I could pose that question right back to you.  I obviously have a different view of what is expected from a school than what you do.  My point was, the tax was too much too fast, and that not all of us came here to take- to your point that the school district is in this financial situation because you have to pay to educate my children.  The only reason that I read this board is because I care about the community too.  Just because I’m ‘new’ here doesn’t mean I have less of a stake in it.  I have even been discussing/debating/looking around for a place to open an arcade or pool hall or something for the teenagers in town.  New residents have helped Stewartstown grow, we are the reason for many of the new businesses you have (like restaurants, Kidsville Junction, etc).  Are we not filling the pockets of the local businesses and therefore giving the business owners in the community more to give back?  Don’t get me wrong, I think the growth should settle down, but come on, we’re not all just taking!

why are we complaining about giving back in the form of taxes, at least we know they are going to our district.  in md the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.  the good schools get more money for programs and the lower performing schools get less, because they are usually your title one schools.  how would you feel if we went to a county wide district and you paid the same in school tax but south eastern got less money for their schools.  how about if some of your taxes went to help pay for The University of Central York high school.  And to your question i don’t have any children.  our district has meet average yearly progress as required by NCLB has york surburban??  is suburban supposed to be a good school?  the district here is a good, it just costs too much to fund it.  we have to deal with the cost of expansion.  400 homes in stewartstown station probably added 800 students to our schools with increased enrollment come increased costs.

i’m very familiar with the county wide set up it isn’t the answer, the way we have it now may not be the answer either but what else to we have.

bevyjean, i think we see eye-to-eye on alot of this my gripe is why complain about something that was a direct result of the population explosion from 1990-present.  my senior year at KD we has 1/2 as many students in my class as the incoming freshman class has.  that is a drastic and sudden increase.  from 113- approx. 220 students.

“Build it and he will come.”

bikertrash - 19 January 2006 05:59 PM

we have to deal with the cost of expansion.  400 homes in stewartstown station probably added 800 students to our schools with increased enrollment come increased costs.

<snip>

i think we see eye-to-eye on alot of this my gripe is why complain about something that was a direct result of the population explosion…

Um, can I just point out that the homes in the stations, and the homes that the “move-ins” bought are all taxed?  Those people are carrying their own load, and it’s not really fair to point to expansion when along with it you get an expansion of your tax base.

In fairness to all involved… while expansion does indeed bring a larger tax base, the amount of tax collected does not cover the cost of educating one child, let alone multiples in one household. In addition, it places a burden on other services in the area. If I recall, for every dollar in residential tax collected for the municipality, the area spends about $1.25 in services (roads, EMS, fire, infrastructure, etc). School is costing somewhere from 6,000 to 9,000 per head (the actual amount is eluding me right now). Property taxes are no where near this much for the average $325,000 home.

The best expansion is light industrial and commercial. They put the least burden on our services for the money they bring. Plus, they don’t have kids in the schools but yet pay property taxes to the schools. Now if we could only get Excelon (Peach Bottom Nuclear Power Plant) to pay their fair share of their taxes…

Let’s just not turn Stewartstown into another Shrewsbury in the process.  Not every town strives or longs to be a Shrewsbury.  But having a county wide school system would allow every town to benefit from the ‘areas’ industrial and commercial business, without having every town becoming inundated with Wal-Marts, Giants, Targets, Home Depots, etc.

The one good thing is that it looks like the heaviest development will stay over around Exit 4, sparing the town itself. There is a lot of land that has been earmarked for commercial/industrial development over there.

Even if we did not do a county system, but rather, expanded the existing district to encompass a few districts (regionalize), we might be better off. I am not saying it is the answer, rather it might be worth digging into and letting the bean counters analyze.

Alex, I agree.  A county wide system may not be completely feasible.  But what we have now isn’t working either, so we need to look into alternatives.  I had suggested ‘regional’ districts in an earlier post.  A fewer number of larger districts may help us all by leaning on each other when needed.  This bunch of little independent districts doesn’t seem to be working anymore.  By the sounds of it, it’s not just our district either.