Southern York County Life

Pooch speaks out as a member of Teacher’s First, and the more I read from him/her the more I realize that he/she is probably looking for a tower to climb!

I think you are right Mark!  My children had Pooch as a teacher and let’s just say she was not the best they ever had.  They LOVEd hearing that she was leaving!

fawnfriend - 11 July 2008 11:33 AM

Pooch speaks out as a member of Teacher’s First, and the more I read from him/her the more I realize that he/she is probably looking for a tower to climb!


I think you are right Mark!  My children had Pooch as a teacher and let’s just say she was not the best they ever had.  They LOVEd hearing that she was leaving!

Are you sure that your kids did not think highly of her?  From what I hear tenure is the only prerequisite for quality teachers? 

May I please come to your work, sit in on your review and help negotiate your salary and what you pay for health care?

When I do so, I don’t want to know anything about your job, except what I think I already do and I don’t want to know anything about your life, because I already know everything I need to know.

frogdog - 14 July 2008 12:12 PM

May I please come to your work, sit in on your review and help negotiate your salary and what you pay for health care?

When I do so, I don’t want to know anything about your job, except what I think I already do and I don’t want to know anything about your life, because I already know everything I need to know.

If you paid my salary you probably would want to negotiate it.  It would be a shame for you to not know about my job and what I do though.

Funny, I do pay my salary in a round about way - live here, work here, yep, I pay my salary.  So does my neighbor.  However, my neighbor (using the term loosely) thinks he knows my job, or many of the other jobs within the district.  Until you sit in that chair, walk in those shoes, it’s easy to criticize.  Make mistakes, yep - but I could go to your job and probably in one day tell you 100 different ways you could do it better, but is it accurate - No - because I’ve seen one day or just a few minutes here and there.  We are not a perfect society, but as a district, I believethat 99% of all employees - from the board on down puts the children first.  Make mistakes - yep, but we try very hard. 

If nothing else, our little marching band and football team prove that every year.  Little yet mighty and proud of who they are and what they are trying to do.  If SESD staff wasn’t doing their job it wouldn’t show in our students.  Everywhere you look our students are proud - do we laugh at our little towns, yep, but we are proud also of who and what we are that makes SESD.

frogdog - 14 July 2008 12:12 PM

May I please come to your work, sit in on your review and help negotiate your salary and what you pay for health care?
When I do so, I don’t want to know anything about your job, except what I think I already do and I don’t want to know anything about your life, because I already know everything I need to know.

That is what we have with our school board now.  A bunch of people that don’t know squat negotiating with one of the most powerful unions in the country over millions of dollars.  Community input is exactly what is needed in this negotiation process!  The tapaying citizens of our community bring such a wealth of talent from the corporate world to the table that the board should be begging for thier input, instead they kick them to curb as uniformed rubes!

To directly respond to your post.  If you are paying my salary and the salaries of my employees with your tax dollars I would welcome you to come in and give me input on my business.  I would be happy to teach you whatever you need to know about my business and employees, so you can be educated about your suggestions. 

On the opposite end of the spectrum we have a school board that has drained the community money pool while scorning anyone who has constructive input on how it should be spent!  If you are a teacher, you chose to be a civil servant.  You chose to work under the rules that PA teachers abide by so live with it.  The community should have a loud voice in this process and the jobs of those on the board should hinge on the outcome.

In any case, no one will ever sit in on a teacher’s review which determines their income… so I don’t even understand the reason for this discussion.  You should be more offended that everyone you work with is going to get the same raise as you every year no matter how much they contribute and now matter whether or not they work hard, have the same amount of education as you, years of service, etc.  No sense in taking reality and turning it into hypotheticals to be upset about, I’d be upset about the reality, not actually being evaluated on merit.

The community should have a loud voice in this process and the jobs of those on the board should hinge on the outcome.

These ideas are exactly what the district and the community do not need.  There is no reason the school board should be bound by the voice of the community beyond those reasons of ethics.  The people did elect them to do the best they can.  They are not there however to listen to the loudest, shrillest voices yelling about every single penny that gets spent.  If every business had to justify every penny to the stakeholders, they wouldnt be a business long.  That is why the stakeholders put someone else in charge.  So they dont have to micromanage.

The shouts and complaints about the union and thier contract are kind of funny.  In reality, if I could do it, I would give everyone 10% up front.  Right now.  You want to attract and keep good staff?  Pay them well and treat them well. 

I am inexorably drawn to the Ben Franklin line of people being ‘Penny wise and Pound foolish’.

C

Oh, one more quick hting.  The school board is not a job.  It is an elected volunteer position.

JustPlainC - 14 July 2008 01:15 PM

The community should have a loud voice in this process and the jobs of those on the board should hinge on the outcome.

These ideas are exactly what the district and the community do not need.  There is no reason the school board should be bound by the voice of the community beyond those reasons of ethics.  The people did elect them to do the best they can.  They are not there however to listen to the loudest, shrillest voices yelling about every single penny that gets spent.  If every business had to justify every penny to the stakeholders, they wouldnt be a business long.  That is why the stakeholders put someone else in charge.  So they dont have to micromanage.

The shouts and complaints about the union and thier contract are kind of funny.  In reality, if I could do it, I would give everyone 10% up front.  Right now.  You want to attract and keep good staff?  Pay them well and treat them well. 

I am inexorably drawn to the Ben Franklin line of people being ‘Penny wise and Pound foolish’.

C

Oh, one more quick hting.  The school board is not a job.  It is an elected volunteer position.

Wow, JPC the 2 of us are very often on the same page, but I think that we are in different libraries on this one!

So the community should elect a school board and sit back and let them call the shots without any input on everything except moral issues?  Cirricculum is the job of Dr. Shank, but the board is put in place by the commmunity to be our representatives to the school in the areas of policy, procedure and fiscal matters.  Businesses do justify every penny that they spend.  The ones that do not don’t survive or are Government organizations.

Penny wise and Pound foolish is probably not really applicable here.  The last thing that the SESD board has been is penny wise.  And yes, I do realize that the board members are elected volunteers and I appreciate the job that they do, but as I have said many, many times on this board that it is time to replace that volunteer board with a paid CEO and CFO that are held accountable to US the Stakeholders of the SESD.  $43 million is just way too much money for this group of people to control without an expectation of accountability to those that pay that money.

The community does have a right to have a loud voice - but please, before speaking, make sure you know what you are saying.  Sometimes too many cooks ruin the soup.  There is no way all of the persons in the SESD will agree on everything, therefore, we do the best we can.  Do we make mistakes - yep!  No matter who is doing the job people will complain.  The goal is to make sure the people doing the job have the same goal - the students.

frogdog - 14 July 2008 03:32 PM

The community does have a right to have a loud voice - but please, before speaking, make sure you know what you are saying.  Sometimes too many cooks ruin the soup.  There is no way all of the persons in the SESD will agree on everything, therefore, we do the best we can.  Do we make mistakes - yep!  No matter who is doing the job people will complain.  The goal is to make sure the people doing the job have the same goal - the students.

Absolutely! 

It is impossible to make everyone happy for sure, but I think that a group like the Tax Coalition is important for representing that group with like ideas, and it is good that Students First represents the thoughts and ideas of that group.

Mark,
I agree.  There is a place for all of these entities, but they all need to remember what the end goal is.

I sometimes wonder about what these groups end goal is. 

Students First has gone to a SB meeting and in front of students and teachers that are presenting the very core of what everyone would like to see in a school system turn around and dog the system.  I know that there are limited times for the forums to speak for themselves, but they also must realize they need to temper to the entire audience, not just the BAD Folk they want to hear them.

To me, everything SF has said is null and void - because they have presented themselves in such a way that they haven’t put Students First.

frogdog - 14 July 2008 08:42 PM

I sometimes wonder about what these groups end goal is.

The Mission of the South Eastern Tax Reform Coalition is to ensure fiscal responsibility and strong accountability by the South Eastern District School Board, by monitoring the budget and expenditures of the South Eastern School District and to take steps to ensure school-spending is directed to the education of our children, not squandered frivolously.

You can read more at http://www.setrc.net Our vision and goals are listed under the “Our Purpose” tab.

frogdog - 14 July 2008 08:42 PM

I sometimes wonder about what these groups end goal is. 

Students First has gone to a SB meeting and in front of students and teachers that are presenting the very core of what everyone would like to see in a school system turn around and dog the system.  I know that there are limited times for the forums to speak for themselves, but they also must realize they need to temper to the entire audience, not just the BAD Folk they want to hear them.

To me, everything SF has said is null and void - because they have presented themselves in such a way that they haven’t put Students First.

My only exposure to SF is through this forum and the representation that I have seen here does not entice me to attend their meetings.  Just the opposite.  That said, I still believe that they have every right to voice their opinion.